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Re: [ProgSoc] Drying up, hands or money



Nathan de Vries wrote:
In short, his argument (which I believe to be similar to yours) is that
typical cognitive bias places too much importance on the information we
can glean from mathematics, science and analysis.
What you've said is meaningless. Do you know what "information" is? 
Other words for "information" are "randomness" and "entropy". There is 
no "information" in mathematics. Analysis does not produce 
"information", and no-one is quite sure what "science" really is ('cept, 
It Works, Bitches!).
Here, get a clue [1,2,3]. ;)

Your reaction to scientific extremism reminds me very much of the
Western demonisation of Islamic culture. Kill 'em all, right?
Are you talking to me?

Nope. Nothing like that. You've missed the point.


[1] http://www.dict.org/bin/Dict?Form=Dict2&Database=*&Query=mathematics

  Mathematics \Math`e*mat"ics\, n. [F. math['e]matiques, pl., L.
     mathematica, sing., Gr. ? (sc. ?) science. See Mathematic,
     and -ics.]
     That science, or class of sciences, which treats of the exact
     relations existing between quantities or magnitudes, and of
     the methods by which, in accordance with these relations,
     quantities sought are deducible from other quantities known
     or supposed; the science of spatial and quantitative
     relations.
     [1913 Webster]

     Note: Mathematics embraces three departments, namely: 1.
           Arithmetic. 2. Geometry, including Trigonometry
           and Conic Sections. 3. Analysis, in which letters
           are used, including Algebra, Analytical Geometry,
           and Calculus. Each of these divisions is divided into
           pure or abstract, which considers magnitude or quantity
           abstractly, without relation to matter; and mixed or
           applied, which treats of magnitude as subsisting in
           material bodies, and is consequently interwoven with
           physical considerations.
           [1913 Webster]


[2] http://www.dict.org/bin/Dict?Form=Dict2&Database=*&Query=analysis

Analysis \A*nal"y*sis\, n.; pl. Analyses. [Gr. ?, fr. ? to
     unloose, to dissolve, to resolve into its elements; ? up + ?
     to loose. See Loose.]
     1. A resolution of anything, whether an object of the senses
        or of the intellect, into its constituent or original
        elements; an examination of the component parts of a
        subject, each separately, as the words which compose a
        sentence, the tones of a tune, or the simple propositions
        which enter into an argument. It is opposed to
        synthesis.
        [1913 Webster]

     2. (Chem.) The separation of a compound substance, by
        chemical processes, into its constituents, with a view to
        ascertain either (a) what elements it contains, or (b) how
        much of each element is present. The former is called
        qualitative, and the latter quantitative analysis.
        [1913 Webster]

     3. (Logic) The tracing of things to their source, and the
        resolving of knowledge into its original principles.
        [1913 Webster]

     4. (Math.) The resolving of problems by reducing the
        conditions that are in them to equations.
        [1913 Webster]

     5.
        (a) A syllabus, or table of the principal heads of a
            discourse, disposed in their natural order.
        (b) A brief, methodical illustration of the principles of
            a science. In this sense it is nearly synonymous with
            synopsis.
            [1913 Webster]

     6. (Nat. Hist.) The process of ascertaining the name of a
        species, or its place in a system of classification, by
        means of an analytical table or key.
        [1913 Webster]


[3] http://www.dict.org/bin/Dict?Form=Dict2&Database=*&Query=science

  Science \Sci"ence\, n. [F., fr. L. scientia, fr. sciens, -entis,
     p. pr. of scire to know. Cf. Conscience, Conscious,
     Nice.]
     1. Knowledge; knowledge of principles and causes; ascertained
        truth of facts.
        [1913 Webster]

              If we conceive God's sight or science, before the
              creation, to be extended to all and every part of
              the world, seeing everything as it is, . . . his
              science or sight from all eternity lays no necessity
              on anything to come to pass.          --Hammond.
        [1913 Webster]

              Shakespeare's deep and accurate science in mental
              philosophy.                           --Coleridge.
        [1913 Webster]

     2. Accumulated and established knowledge, which has been
        systematized and formulated with reference to the
        discovery of general truths or the operation of general
        laws; knowledge classified and made available in work,
        life, or the search for truth; comprehensive, profound, or
        philosophical knowledge.
        [1913 Webster]

              All this new science that men lere [teach].
                                                    --Chaucer.
        [1913 Webster]

              Science is . . . a complement of cognitions, having,
              in point of form, the character of logical
              perfection, and in point of matter, the character of
              real truth.                           --Sir W.
                                                    Hamilton.
        [1913 Webster]

     3. Especially, such knowledge when it relates to the physical
        world and its phenomena, the nature, constitution, and
        forces of matter, the qualities and functions of living
        tissues, etc.; -- called also natural science, and
        physical science.
        [1913 Webster]

              Voltaire hardly left a single corner of the field
              entirely unexplored in science, poetry, history,
              philosophy.                           --J. Morley.
        [1913 Webster]

     4. Any branch or department of systematized knowledge
        considered as a distinct field of investigation or object
        of study; as, the science of astronomy, of chemistry, or
        of mind.
        [1913 Webster]

     Note: The ancients reckoned seven sciences, namely, grammar,
           rhetoric, logic, arithmetic, music, geometry, and
           astronomy; -- the first three being included in the
           Trivium, the remaining four in the Quadrivium.
           [1913 Webster]

                 Good sense, which only is the gift of Heaven,
                 And though no science, fairly worth the seven.
                                                    --Pope.
           [1913 Webster]

     5. Art, skill, or expertness, regarded as the result of
        knowledge of laws and principles.
        [1913 Webster]

              His science, coolness, and great strength. --G. A.
                                                    Lawrence.
        [1913 Webster]

     Note: Science is applied or pure. Applied science is a
           knowledge of facts, events, or phenomena, as explained,
           accounted for, or produced, by means of powers, causes,
           or laws. Pure science is the knowledge of these powers,
           causes, or laws, considered apart, or as pure from all
           applications. Both these terms have a similar and
           special signification when applied to the science of
           quantity; as, the applied and pure mathematics. Exact
           science is knowledge so systematized that prediction
           and verification, by measurement, experiment,
           observation, etc., are possible. The mathematical and
           physical sciences are called the exact sciences.
           [1913 Webster]

     Comparative sciences, Inductive sciences. See under
        Comparative, and Inductive.
        [1913 Webster]

     Syn: Literature; art; knowledge.

     Usage: Science, Literature, Art. Science is literally
            knowledge, but more usually denotes a systematic and
            orderly arrangement of knowledge. In a more
            distinctive sense, science embraces those branches of
            knowledge of which the subject-matter is either
            ultimate principles, or facts as explained by
            principles or laws thus arranged in natural order. The
            term literature sometimes denotes all compositions not
            embraced under science, but usually confined to the
            belles-lettres. [See Literature.] Art is that which
            depends on practice and skill in performance. "In
            science, scimus ut sciamus; in art, scimus ut
            producamus. And, therefore, science and art may be
            said to be investigations of truth; but one, science,
            inquires for the sake of knowledge; the other, art,
            for the sake of production; and hence science is more
            concerned with the higher truths, art with the lower;
            and science never is engaged, as art is, in productive
            application. And the most perfect state of science,
            therefore, will be the most high and accurate inquiry;
            the perfection of art will be the most apt and
            efficient system of rules; art always throwing itself
            into the form of rules." --Karslake.
            [1913 Webster]













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